Locked The state of the Velheim economy

[foxx]

22 hours ago, Sprout said:

This thread has now descended from it's  purpose of getting people to trade more to getting people to 'use the items they are hoarding in there banks' and gp sinks. It'll just add to the cause of hoarding and I personally believe it'll further impact the lack of trading due to the fact I would personally stop selling anything because of having to worry about repair costs then or just stop doing pvm in general tbh so that's already 1 less person trading items. 

 

• If you want items to be repaired more, then add them rs3 style - Patches for the armour, masterwork for trimmed.. Sure.
  • 'Custom' repairing, no. Why? Demoralization, if you think that upping the costs for using higher end gear will help get player to player trading a kick start again you need to have a long hard think about it.

 

• Eco resets are also just a big fat no, same type of people have been suggestion eco resets since the beginning of rsps', I can't recall any server doing better or recovering (player wise) from a eco reset (not to be confused with servers that were taken down and relaunched x year(s)/months later) along with this not addressing the root of the problem, it'll just happen all over again. Please, stop suggesting this. People are not fans of being told that the hours of there life they spent achieving stuff is to be taken away in seconds, not everyone has the same dedication as others and would stick around.  P.s. Not a personal attack on wife, just a rant on the topic going off the rails t.t

 

Now to the topic at hand, my main questions is below as I'd like to dig deeper into the causes for lack of trading before coming up with any suggestions. 

 

Is the current lack of trading effected by;

A. Not enough gp in the Eco.

B. Too much gp in the Eco.

C. Too many Items.

D. Not enough Items. 

 

For those people that have multiple items of any type;

 

What is stopping you from selling your spare items?

A. Price is to Cheap, I don't want to sell.

B. Price is too expensive, most people can't afford.

C. No buyers/Takes to long to find a buyer.

D. I wont sell regardless I just like hoarding. 

E. - Insert your own answer here- 

 

unlimited g/e. very useful, very bad. Also lack of -steady prices/undercutters- remove access to see other prices on g/e even if trying to buy (shows lowest price) or trying to sell (shows highest buyer)? 

I like the g/e the way it is but it's also a very toxic system when someone selling something and they can just check g/e to see who to undercut.

prime example (just happened) below

Going off Sprout, some people just like to hoard and such which leads back to drop rates of things/the time they put in they feel is not worth the amount people offer. Low gp incoming being a big factor. Call me crazy but what is the issue with a person having a lot of wealth? Not like it isn't a common thing but what else to spend it on (other than death costs, instances, supplies) once you've reached a certain point. Maybe give us something else to spend it on that benefits instead of solely having upkeep costs. I feel like a broken record but the well is awesome, if only everyone felt that way. Why can we not make it a more worthwhile thing to do instead of keeping it game mode based. Paying attention to vote parties ~50 give or take, daily, individuals that are not iron or alts. Not a huge market to go with as is especially if they have the item. Maybe adjust alch prices so it's also viable instead of smashing drygores, which are considered almost end game, down to be (10?)m each for example. Sure, it may get rid of the "free economy" system, but in my eyes will remove a lot of toxicity behind arguing over made up prices and such. If the person doesn't want to sell for a price they don't have to and the same reversed. It's like expecting something with no structure to stand, while all it does is lay there and look pretty.

[Sprout]

43 minutes ago, foxx said:

unlimited g/e. very useful, very bad. Also lack of -steady prices/undercutters- remove access to see other prices on g/e even if trying to buy (shows lowest price) or trying to sell (shows highest buyer)? 

I like the g/e the way it is but it's also a very toxic system when someone selling something and they can just check g/e to see who to undercut.

prime example (just happened) below

Going off Sprout, some people just like to hoard and such which leads back to drop rates of things/the time they put in they feel is not worth the amount people offer. Low gp incoming being a big factor. Call me crazy but what is the issue with a person having a lot of wealth? Not like it isn't a common thing but what else to spend it on (other than death costs, instances, supplies) once you've reached a certain point. Maybe give us something else to spend it on that benefits instead of solely having upkeep costs. I feel like a broken record but the well is awesome, if only everyone felt that way. Why can we not make it a more worthwhile thing to do instead of keeping it game mode based. Paying attention to vote parties ~50 give or take, daily, individuals that are not iron or alts. Not a huge market to go with as is especially if they have the item. Maybe adjust alch prices so it's also viable instead of smashing drygores, which are considered almost end game, down to be (10?)m each for example. Sure, it may get rid of the "free economy" system, but in my eyes will remove a lot of toxicity behind arguing over made up prices and such. If the person doesn't want to sell for a price they don't have to and the same reversed. It's like expecting something with no structure to stand, while all it does is lay there and look pretty.

You have made some very good points and suggestions, i'll start off with saying I think gp wise on velheim the raw income and the sinks are currently sitting at a nice level that don't need urgently looking at, rather now we need methods of getting people moving that money around amongst them selves which leads me to my feedback on some of your suggestions. 

GE

The people that uncut by 1 gp are the worst people of all. I'd rather see recently sold prices (rather than current listings prices) to make it a little more exciting, or something along the lines of that so you still get a general idea of prices but you can't go oh that dude is selling it for 50m - Adds mine for 49,999,999.

Unlimited items 100% agree, having a lot of skilling items being able to be auto bought cripples the skillers economy, I think that either adding daily limited on them like the shop or removing higher level unlimited altogether would be a superb way to get money exchanging hands between players rather than having small amounts of gp sink away. Currently archaeology materials are one of the best money making methods in regards to skilling because most of the higher end materials you have to gather your self or buy on a player to player trading basis. 

Minimum Prices

Raising minimum prices, a tricky one but also might be worthwhile looking into. Raising prices would generate cash flow as well as getting rid of overstock and stop items from becoming junk. While there are things that would need to be considered, such as nerfing of drop rates to avoid over farming and generating too much raw gp into the game it's still something worth looking into and getting opinions on. 

I'd also like to take a moment to add that the rarity of peoples and the determination of people farming them is a contribution to such item influxes so if you haven't already (anyone else reading not fox) check out foxes thread regarding pet drop rates 

Well

Never had a problem with the well was here when the well was 20m to fill and gave no drop rate, if people legitimately think the well if 'op' just take the drop rate bonus away from it again and be done with it, no point in punishing people who want the bonus xp by upping the price because of the drop rate. Alternatively add a 2nd thresh hold, 100m/300m activates the xp boost and 300/300m activates the drop rate boost (just using 300m as an example), with any left over rolling over if the top amount is not met, there are other creative ways to adjust the well rather than upping the price and someone has to set Sand some challenges. 

Wealth

I too don't see anything wrong with people having wealth. There will always be casual players that have what they need and billionaires that seek more, it's the same in life. Making more sinks in an attempt to forcing people to use some of there gp in my opinion will ultimately backfire, they'd proberbly do less because of having the goal of being the richest may outweigh there desire to pvm. I myself and a hoarder, I wont let my cash pile ever go below 25b and treat that as zero, if I need 100m to repair my armour but I only have 25b and 72m in the money pouch, I wont be repairing it until I get the 100m xD no amount of costs will change my mindset I just switch to something none degradable or cheap until I get the cash or item needed to repair it.  I'm sure there are others around that do this, if not.. *awkward*

 

[foxx]

57 minutes ago, Sprout said:

Minimum Prices

Raising minimum prices, a tricky one but also might be worthwhile looking into. Raising prices would generate cash flow as well as getting rid of overstock and stop items from becoming junk. While there are things that would need to be considered, such as nerfing of drop rates to avoid over farming and generating too much raw gp into the game it's still something worth looking into and getting opinions on. 

I'd also like to take a moment to add that the rarity of peoples and the determination of people farming them is a contribution to such item influxes so if you haven't already (anyone else reading not fox) check out foxes thread regarding pet drop rates 

 

Farming pets is a very real issue here. Not only does it cause burn out (don't say it doesn't), but exactly as you're saying people just get loads of these items from the bosses and still not the pet they truly want. Although very biased, I think pets should not be considered something that is uber rare and that is definitely a starting point. People should be farming for something they want and not for a damn cosmetic that you can only wear one at a time considering they don't just sit in your storage like the other 100 do. Thank you for the shout on that also. Very pressing topic to me.

57 minutes ago, Sprout said:

Well

Never had a problem with the well was here when the well was 20m to fill and gave no drop rate, if people legitimately think the well if 'op' just take the drop rate bonus away from it again and be done with it, no point in punishing people who want the bonus xp by upping the price because of the drop rate. Alternatively add a 2nd thresh hold, 100m/300m activates the xp boost and 300/300m activates the drop rate boost (just using 300m as an example), with any left over rolling over if the top amount is not met, there are other creative ways to adjust the well rather than upping the price and someone has to set Sand some challenges. 

I, too, remember the 20m well days (or may have been 10m at some point idr) and man were they much simpler. My main goal in mentioning it was to make it MORE worth it. Saying that the DR is "op" doesn't reconcile to me because I believe it to be very underwhelming, actually, if at all. More over, make donating to it give exclusive rewards to people similar to vote parties. You donated in the threshold of x amount of gp - you obtained this badass loot box/title/outfit/whatever. If we just say "nobody cares about an outfit" that fixes nothing. If the loot is worth it to whomever, the gp will get dumped. Just make it sick either unobtainables, give vcoins, etc and not just a loss of money for skillers to get a hard on. Adding an extra threshold to it is an amazing idea in that sense. Could go as far making different wells for different game modes, and if that game mode group doesn't want to donate for it - they do not reap the benefits(?)

57 minutes ago, Sprout said:

Wealth

I too don't see anything wrong with people having wealth. There will always be casual players that have what they need and billionaires that seek more, it's the same in life. Making more sinks in an attempt to forcing people to use some of there gp in my opinion will ultimately backfire, they'd proberbly do less because of having the goal of being the richest may outweigh there desire to pvm. I myself and a hoarder, I wont let my cash pile ever go below 25b and treat that as zero, if I need 100m to repair my armour but I only have 25b and 72m in the money pouch, I wont be repairing it until I get the 100m xD no amount of costs will change my mindset I just switch to something none degradable or cheap until I get the cash or item needed to repair it.  I'm sure there are others around that do this, if not.. *awkward*

 

Agreed with every sentence. My money stack gets sharded, and I pretend like I reset. Although not everyone is like this, it's a very sad thing to try to ruin some peoples game style choice. The main thing we have seen with 'forcing' people to do things they do not want is they can just leave, that simple. A lot people I know have left for one of many reasons, not saying they were bad 'updates/changes' but like Sprout is saying - people have their own goals and things they actually enjoy logging in for. If we can find a different way to do the same thing, but cheaper - you already know it's going to happen which will just go back to the same issue and for what? A slight/major inconvenience just to get backdoored by big brains.